What is that MES does regarding the songwriting on Fall records? Obviously he writes the lyrics but does he contribute to the music as well? If he doesn't directly write songs does he add ideas, tell the band how it should go: slow it down, speed it up, get rid of that, use this? What's his contribution to the sound of the records?

I think MES has his own ideas as to how his song should sound, and employs his musicians to achieve that sound.

His instructions can be heard on many tracks, eg:
"Take it down" / "Up up up up up" - Smile
"Switch" - NWRA
"Turn it down, Marc" - Hard Life In Country (In A Hole version)
"Come on, put some fucking guts into it" - No Xmas (Totales)


In the BBC4 documentary, he strolls round the studio (Peel session recording day) with what looks like a small cassette player, playing what he thinks the band should be aiming for sound wise. (And don't forget his hilarious cymbals contribution to that same session!)

I suspect he must write at least SOME of the actual music as so many of the groups recordings are simply credited to Smith.

Rolling stones said im a pizza, I could use a lemon squeezer.
MES is the lime squeezer.

I imagine it would involve singing riffs etc to the musicians or just plonking them out himself on a keyboard, saying "That. For 6 minutes." and everyone goes from there. :D

I think it might be like this: Mr Smith [a] grimacing; [b] looking peeved; [c] looking less peeved. The musicians aim for [c] less peeved. :)

He offers advice to the musicians... like play it more like a snake ... or give it some rosso rosso.

I think if MES came up with the main riff idea, or he thinks he did... then MES gets sole credits.

BTW, Mr Hogg, congrats on you No.1 post, and welcome aboard!

{No one ever welcomed me! :angry: :cry: } :lol:

Not to forget:
"Will you fucking get it together instead of showing off?" :lol:

And "Don't start improvising for Christ's sake" on Slates, Slags etc

Yes.

And the writing credits are, for the most part, meaningless.

I think it was because the moderators were tied up looking after the more "volatile" posters and wanted to see how you'd do first. maybe there's a celebration on your 1st anniversary if you keep up the good work :)

Why, thank you duckpin!

Should think so too! :rant:

:) glad we're in accord....would you prefer a sedan or a motorcycle?

Or even...

"C'mon yer fuckin pot heads" (or something like that) - Strychnine (Live Variuos Years) :lol:

:nahnah:

Welcome Rainmaster

:lol:

MES don't "do", he be...

there's a bootleg tape that i heard where you can hear mes dictating (if memory serves) cab it up to the gruppe.

he sort of "beatboxes" the rhythm and hums/scats the bass and guitar bits, kind of like that bit at the beginning of inch, but far more coherent.

Thank you, nice to be here! :lol:

MES turns up drunk, shouts at people, and then plays merry buggery with the monitors - he be messying wid der heads (basically...).
Seems to work, though.

PS Don't try this at your actual place of work.

Anyone can hear an (audio) proof that MES is actualy dictating what he wants, musicaly, to musicians when you hear the opening track of the Inch EP >

MES: But, yeah, it's gotta go down, y'know... y'know the music's gotta go fuckin' down-uh
Keir Stewart: Yeah
MES: What you best... what best getting him to do, Kier...
KS: Yeah
MES: ...is getting him to fuckin' sit at a table and fuckin' play the fuckin' drumbeat
KS: Yeah
MES: Y'know... y'know, just like (drum noises)
KS: Yeah
MES: Y'know what I mean? Deh deh deh deh... deh deh deh deh... then Steve and Simon come in like (drum noises)

I notice Mr Hogg didn't come back.
One post, but never again.
What did we say????

C'mon, it's only been a day. Maybe he has, y'know, a life.

Remember ?

:mellow:

I hate those people with a life. Grrr...

My last Fall listening less than two minutes ago.
Wrong thread?

And a fair bit of "guidance" from MES as to how the gruppe should perform Blindness.

No reply Elvis because I was in England and asleep :D

But thanks, all your replies were great. I was suspicious that MES rode a few musicians coat-tails and the success of the Fall was more about who he was lucky enough to get in than what he did.

That said, I get the feeling that in the early days they were more of a band, all contributing as a band, more than a vehicle for MES.

Talking of bandleaders giving instruction I think my favourite has to be Captain Beefheart's to his drummer when he said he wanted him to make a sound like a 'kitten trying to get out of a cardboard box'.

I don't know how but I know that sound.

Uh-huh, once were band, then was group...

What kind of part did he play when they were the insect Posse?
or the triple gang, or Frenz even?