How too equip the von carsteins?


I have some problem with what to give too my count.

Here is the 2000pt list as it looks now.
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Count+ level. Talon off death. Ring off nigth sword off migth

Wight Lord hew arm. E shield. Sword off kings

Necro level 2 book off A

Necro lev 2 staff off dam

20 skell full comand. Ligth arm (vampier here)

10 skell, full comand

8 wolfs, champion

19 grave guards full comand, shields, banner off barrows

5 black knigths, barding full comand, war banner

2 spirit hosts

2 banshee.

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I have tried too give the count the cursed book instead off the talon, but i wanted him too be more aggressive.

Any tips on how too equip him . any coment off the army is wellcom!

(and english isnt my first language)

Bear in mind these are just ideas, and some standard setups. You are really perfectly free to do your own setups, just that with experience, you'll see why certain things are taken more often than others.

Aura of Dark Majesty: You hardly ever not see this on a Von Carstein Count. For added mobility to your army. In large games, start them all within 18", wolves within 18" (meaning that your deployment can actually afford to span more than 18" from your general, since if 1 model in the unit is within 18" the whole unit can march), and fan out right from the start. Allows you to play a mobile game instead of having everything clumped around your general.

Walking Death: +1CR. Really good.

Ring of the Night: Bog-standard 5+ Ward Save available to almost everyone and most of their mothers in the Warhammer world. The basic protection for a Vampire Count/Lord. None better, really, for the pts cost. Crown of Stupidity can really screw you up even if you're a Lord. The others too specialized.

Blood Drinker: Now personally I always go for great weapon, but this staffer I know who's a lot more experienced than I am prefers Blood Drinker and Gem of Blood. In his experience the Blood Drinker can keep the Count alive pretty well, and the Gem of Blood is something he's willing to chance. Me, I don't quite agree, but you try it and see what works for you.

Summon Wolves: I will give this power to a Thrall, usually, but if you want another d3 wolves you can give it to your Count. If you have no Thralls, like in your list, you should consider this. War-machine hunting crew. Can hunt lone characters later in the game. Can march block. Useful.

The Carstein Ring: Ultimate in survivability equipment, but you can't take anything else at all on your Count if you have the Ring. Take the Ring if you know you'll be up against something crappy like Clan Eshin (SoC list) Master Assassin, or Shadowblade, or someone like that. Otherwise, I won't bother.

Cursed Book: It serves a dual purpose - in close combat, it aids in survivability (almost everything hits your Count on 5+ or worse), and it contributes to having higher CR, since they hit your RnF worse as well. So it sort of does what the Ring of the Night and Walking Death do, a little bit of both. It also has a very minor radius effect, meaning that a few other units nearby benefit. However you've got to think, it doesn't work against anything else. Shooting: no. Magic: no. Template effects: no. And so forth. Your call.


I can't think of anything else a Von Carstein Count might want, at least not in the normal list. In the SoC Sylvanian List he might want something different, but you're not playing that, so nevermind.

Try it out yourself. Oh and for your info - try the Talon of Death on a mounted Wraith. Absolutely kills warmachine crew, and can seriously hurt enemy fast cavalry and small skirmisher units. Do bear in mind, though, that the Talon's casualties do NOT, do NOT count towards CR since they're done at the end of the Movement phase.

thanks alot!

that wraith thig i got to try. just stay have to watch out for magic warmachines.

as i mainly play dwarfs a greatweapon migth be the winner as it adds S take away some armour and leaves points for other things.

i realy like curesd book and walking death but they eaqules 85 points. that leaves me with no ring off nigth. and with a greatweapon i need some save. buggerit

well... greatweapon, walking death, ring off nigth and Aura/summon Wolfs. Aura or wolfs...

do u have any other coments about the army?

Lol, that last is exactly my setup for Lefred von Carstein (which is actually me, if you can see the anagram). I take the Aura because my daughter Luna's the wolf-girl.

I also have Earthbind, but that's because I use the Sylvanian List. I assume you know what it is? If not feel free to ask.

The army... well... drop the unit of 10 skellies. Near-useless. I know you want to raise it up to strength, but your enemy is just gonna shoot it to bits first, and that gives him easy VP. And your opponents are mainly Dwarves.

Personally I think in terms of infantry blocks, 2 is sufficient. You may have 3 if you like, but do this: reduce the wolves to 5, without champion (yes i know you waste the 3 models from the goblin box, but that's for you to summon, see? :)), and lose one banshee. That gives you 130pts, for 10 skeletons with light armour. Then you will have 3 big infantry blocks. Just as DLJ likes :)

Try Vampire with Grave Guard. Really good. But it does focus power into 1 unit. You have the idea of spreading it out a little. Well and good, try it and see what works for you.

Try also mounting the Wight Lord and putting him with the Black Knights, with the same eq combo that you have. Combine charges with Black Knights and Spirit Hosts. You can break even Dwarves on the charge, especially if you flank them with your wolves at the same time. Nice thing about dwarves is, you can run circles around them, and there's not much they can do about it :)

But do watch out for the war machines! Either use the Banshee, which is expensive and not very effective in this role, or take some Fell Bats. Although they're not so good against Dwarves (due to high Ld, high T, etc), they can at least tie up the war machines.

Again, bear in mind, don't take what I say for the definite truth! Try it yourself. See what fits. Play with proxy models at first, to get the feel of how it would work. Then make your decision. :)

3 big blocks.

the idea is offcourse raisng alot. and the bad thing about this u say is what if he shoots down the unit before i have a chanse. well that whoud be great if he are waisting his firepower on simple skelletons i am more than happy. the other problem is when faceing a anti-magic army. i have no defens vs that one.

frell bats/wolfs. i used my wolfs as u described the fell bats ie charge his flame cannon. fellbats migth be better when it comes to this but they arent a core unit and i need core units ( have the minimum rigth now)

banshee. i dont have these moddels yet but i intend too get them. when i tried the army vs the dwarfs they took out one cannon one runesmith and (tam tam tam taam) the dwarf lord! this mostly becourse off luck and not too brigth moves by the dwarf player. when i laste used one vs beastmen she got the wargore (general) and 2 trolls. i like banshees...

spreading power. i have the vamp in the skellie unit and the wight lord with the grave guard. until i have more knigths (only got five rigth now) i think the w lord will stay with the grave guard. and there is NOTHING that can stop the vampier from changeing unit. last tme hi did that the ironbreakers went for a short run. hehehe.
so spreading power and having the ability too sumon it if that is needed.


what i did notise is that graveguard are easily shoot down and maybe i should change thier banner to Banner off Doom. but that whould make them worse figthers.



well. i will try some off your tips, proxing some knigths and fellbats. Migth work fine.

I should've stated straight off the most important reason for not relying on magic to do something vital like boosting a block from practically zero to a horde.

It's magic. It's dice. It's luck. It's unreliable.

Back in the days before the Sylvanian list came out, I was playing with 2 Necros. Had hell of a time keeping them alive, but that's not the point. All too often, I failed to cast Vanhel's when it would have made the difference... or it got dispelled... or failed to cast Invocation when I needed it... or rolled too low for models raised... or failed utterly to cast Gaze when I needed to get a bunch of Pistoliers off my back... or, in any of these cases, Miscast.

Hard to rely on. With luck it can win the game for you, but you've invested points into it, so when it doesn't pay off, you're left high and dry.

You can tell I've indoctrinated Derfel an awful lot to my way of playing the army, can't you? ^_^

Your army list does seem to be a bit support-heavy, in my opinion. I work around the premise of 2 big blocks at 1000 pts, and then at least one more block for each 1000 pts after that. These blocks should be BIG, so you don't have to waste magic raising into them, and so they can take missile and magic casualties. Plus with fear-causers, everything counts in large numbers.

Walking Death is my favourite bloodline power. Anything that makes it easier for you to win combat is great. Aura is not so important if you are basing your plan around a solid infantry line: you'll need to be close to each other to mutually support each other. Banshee's, bats and ghouls can work independantly, and black knights can keep up with your infantry outside of the generals range anyway.

Leave the Grave Guard as they are. If you take another large (20 strong) unit of skellies/zombies, and have that led by another powerful combat character, the Grave Guard will act as more of a distraction from your other power bases whilst still being bloody tough buggers themselves.

As Derfel said, relying on magic is basically relying on the luck of the dice. There will be games where you'll destroy your opponent with an unstoppable barrage of spells, and there will be other times when you will fail to cast just about all of them. The game is won and lost in the movement and combat phases anyway, so I like to build my armies to do well in those phases.

Cheers,
DLJ

I have made some changes in the list based on the comments from Derfel. I have more knigths this time. I whould like to have the cursed book for the vampier but i could not find any room for it :(

Magic vs figthy things. The army could do with about 20 more skelletons (10 for each unit) or a large block off zombies to hold off a enemy unit for some turns.
But for every necro i drop the army loses one dispell dice. And both off them costs only as much as 26 skelletons. In a realy lucky game they can raise that number off moddels. And ward off one or two incoming spells.
Necromansy is a great lore! It can raise new unit off troops behind the enemy lines. That gives alot off tactical power.

When i play empier i never relay on magic, i go for big blocks off infantry hth detatchments. two cannons, some knigths and a scroll caddy. But when i play vampier counts i think that 6 magic levels in 2000 pts isnt realy too much. It can go terrebly wrong but with averrage luck they will bring me the support i need. and dont worry If they fail me alot i will kick em out!!


Count+ level. Walking Death, Aura off D, Ring off Nigth. Great weapon

Wight Lord hew arm. E shield. Sword off kings

Necro level 2 book off A

Necro lev 2 staff off dam

19 skell full comand. Ligth arm (vampier here)

10 skell, standard, champion

8 wolfs, champion

19 grave guards full comand, shields, banner off barrows

8 black knigths, barding full comand, war banner

2 spirit hosts

2 banshee.

2002 pts.


:)

keep killing the list!

My Von Carstein thrall configuration:

Flayed Hauberk, Wolf Form, Great Weapon

Dispute it all you want, why this 'might not' work and what not, but it's been tactically sound for me so far (mostly because I use von carstein in sub-2k games). The wolf form is extremely nice, pop out for some mage killing, join a unit of wolves and do some wraith train tactics, jump into a combat you know you're going to win (if theres any uncertainty, keep him away... you don't want your thrall to go dying from CR do you?).

Anyway, that's my two cents... I'm sure there are many other configurations, but as far as solid heroes go, this one suits me well.

Thanks again :)

Scrappy