was anyone else kind of embarassed at kanye's words during that telethon? i mean dudes got a right to speak his mind and all but that wasnt the time or place for all that shit. i think its only gonna fuel the race fire. but yo i just want you guys to know i got mad respect for everyone hear and your opinions even if i dont share the same idea's but im glad i didnt buy kanye's album and im sure as hell not going to now. its hard being a white republican in the city of detroit. sounds stupid but i hope i still got your guys respect after letting yall know im republican. cause around here i gotta keep my mouth shut about my political views . even around my friends.

what exactly did kanye say?

btw, I'm one of the most liberal people you'll ever meet but I'm not going to hold it against you that you're views are different than mine...I may debate with you...but there would be no hard feelings. Never be afraid to voice what you believe in.

nah, im not here to argue. dont like to argue with friends and even though i havnt met any of you i still would consider you friends. i dont like to debate because most likely it wont change my views and i wont be able to change yours. what kanye said doesnt bother me at all. really it doesnt. i just dont think it was the time or place to express his opinion. im not a devoted bush fan and alot of people think that because im republican im a redneck lovin war monger. but its not the case. i baught kanye's college dropout cd and even though im a fan of his music i believe he is overated and extremely arrogant. he didnt have my respect before and now he will never gain it from me. nor do i believe that kanye should be a mogul for you guys. he was never poor and came from a middle class family. i dont think he should represent the poor underpriveladged black community. it was the wrong time to turn this into a race debate.

He has his first amendment rights to say what he wanted, but he could have picked a different forum to address his views. To understand that not all poor people are a minority first and to know that everyone there have thing in common, they are humans. Kanye should have instead went there and helped. A celebrity opens their mouth, they need to back it up.

now that I know you're a republican... you suck and your beats are trash





just kidding

but I feel Kanye opinions weren't really out of line. Did it make people uncomfortable? Yes... just ask mike myers... he looked like he wanted to crawl under a rock. He spoke the truth.... he even admitted that he is in a way a hypocrite because he went shopping before offering help. My only complaint was how he voiced his opinion... he could've addressed the issue in a more civilized manner. His thoughts were all over the place, but that tends to happen when you're upset.

a recent article in the new york post showed two pictures. one had a black man with some bread and water that he "stole", the other one right below it had a white man who "managed to find some chips and soda to feed himself"

i'm not one to randomly throw out the word racism.... but come on now

yo i know how the media spins this and im not going to defend how the media uses race as a tool. i know it happens. but i am one freakin confused individual being white trying to make it in a black mans world(the hip hop world that is). thats not to say i dont know myself because i do stay true and real to my self. im confused as to why so many people want to make it a racial issue. kanye had every right to say what he said. didnt upset me cause im not a huge bush fan. just because i believe in the idea's that republicans represent i get labled pretty quick. alot of people want to assume im rich because of those views. Im far from it. still living on unemployment as a matter of fact. i used to debate polotics all the time with friends and what not but in the past year or so ive been more concerned with doing what ive gotta do for myself first. if kanye would have said "bush doesnt care about poor people" different story all together. at least it wouldnt have been about race. you know if it would have been jesse jackson or al sharpton i wouldnt even be talking about it. but kanye is the one of the most arrogant sob's in the game. dude has a painting of himself portrayed as an angel and i think thats completly ludacris in my eyes. PUT THIS ON RECORD. IF I EVER MEET KANYE IN PERSON I WILL BITCH SLAP HIS ARROGANT ASS. and not for what he said on tv. but for being the kind of person he is.

some more thaughts.

i dont like how celebrities in general use their power to influence people politically. in a song i believe its different though. only because you can choose if you want to listen to that song if you agree with it politically. people watching the telethon didnt have a choice but to watch him say that. unless you have the reflexes of a jungle cat with the clicker. i wouldnt mind it so much but people idolize these people and agree with their views solely on the fact they are celebrities. not all but alot. and i dont want people to get the wrong idea. myself not buying his albums is a boycott of his character not his political views. shit, i dont agree with eminems political views but i will buy all his albums. its because of his humility and humbleness. he doesnt bitch when he doesnt win an award and it seems as though he could care less if he ever wins one award. thats why i admire him.

98% of rappers are arrogant.... but anyway, carry on

^^that might be true, and ive met alot of arrogent little bitches but that doesnt earn anyones respect. but the way kanye goes about it is the wrong way. if you step to me with humility i'll sho you respect. and i guess i'll have alot of bitch slapping to do!! LOL

Never hold what the Jewish dominated New York Post says with value.

i'll stick to the detroit free press and monroe evening news.

just to add. 10th, that video in your sig is funny as hell.

my question is...what did kanye say?

"George Bush does not care about black people"

thats it?

I agree 100%

sounds like someone is angry at kanye because he said something bad about bush...I've noticed that bush supporters are amazingly connected to the man.

so you have to come from a poor family in order to care about poor people? Another thing, unfortunately race and socioeconomic status many times go hand in hand, so the slow response in N.O. can be attributed to either or both. But I think race is definitely a more prevalent force in the governments poor treatment and slow respnose to those people. And I applaud Kanye for having the balls to get on national television and air that out.

i never said you have to be poor to care about the poor community. the point i am trying to make is that i highly doubt the administration sat down and said "hey look at all those poor people. looks to me like theyre black. lets let em suffer for a few more days" kanye didnt say george bush doesnt care about poor people. if that was what he would have said i probably would agree. but thats not what he said. his exact words were "george bush doesnt care about BLACK people. theres a huge difference. you may be able to prove bush doesnt care about poor people but show me some proof that he singles out a race. either way he shouldnt have used a fund raiser to express his political views.

his political views dealt with what that fundraiser was supporting, why not bring it up then? The way the situation was handled happens to be rooted in politics, do you want people to act like thats not the case? And quite frankly, black people overwhelmingly were the people in the areas in need of help, whether they were rich or poor we don't know from the footage, but one thing we can agree on is that most of them were black. I wouldn't even stop at saying bush doesn't care about black people. I would say the government doesn't care about black people. how the hell could this situation happen in america is my question? you got people sitting on rooftops with no food for day upon day, then you finally get the snail-paced government officials rolling in pointing m16s at them and making them out to be criminals because they got a bite to eat or some clothes to put on their backs. what else did they expect the people to do? they have nothing, and if they did have money on them there was no workers in the stores to sell it to them! the handling of the louisiana situation was absolutely embarrassing and I think it damn sure was race related. very sad to see in 2005. All I can say is I'm doing my part and there are a lot of people lending a hand. I'm proud to see that, but bush just keeps on reinforcing the reasons I think he's an incompetent "leader". And his supporters continue to make less and less sense in their defense of him each time he fucks something up.

you shouldnt believe everything you see on tv. even the extreme right wingers pointed out that the percentage of looters was very small and the media blew it up like it was an epidemic. no one was being shot at for taking food and necessities. the world is not a perfect place. im not defending the whitehouse for their actions. the reaction time was horrible. but dont tell me they hesitated because they were black. you cant prove it. the local government is as much at fault as the federal. you can speculate all day but just like in a court room if you dont have proof you have nothing. i think it had more to do with the fact that the government really didnt know what to do.

I bet they would have found out what to do faster if the race of the people was not overwhelmingly black. and I don't belive I ever mentioned any being shot at. by the way, I'm the last person who believes everything on tv. but theres not much believing or disbelieving when you clearly hear people trying to survive being referred to as "looters" and clearly see children chanting "we want help" 5 days after the storm has passed and the destruction has taken place, and also clearly see guns being pointed to keep people "under control".

we just see things differently. i would refer to the people that were stealing tv's and videogames looters. that much we can agree on. im just going on what ive seen. when kanye says bush doesnt care about black people he's singeling out a race. although the population is mostly black there were people of all ethnic backgrounds that were suffering. thats why i dont agree with what he said. im glad to hear that you are doing your part Ill. ive also donated lots of clothing to the puple heart as i have been doing for years. we could speculate that race played apart all day. but how can you condemn someone to be racist without knowing for a fact that he is?

I can condemn someone to be a racist by his actions. He obviously doesn't care about the poor, which are disproportionately black, and he obviously doesn't care about black people because of his extremely slooow response along with the rest of the government, to this tragedy that affected mostly black people.

what about the local government? are they not to blame also? why are they not held responsible as well?

dont want to start a kanye hate fest but i stubled across this. you can form your own opinion.

A producer named IceDrake(Produced the original "Splash Waterfalls for Ludacris) already dissed him and put him on blast. Ice Drake said that him and Kanye were producing partners. This was in the Eminem issue of XXL magazine in the production credit section.(March 2004 p.179) Here's that main part of what Icedrake was saying in the article verbatim.

XXL:"You and Kanye West used to be partners right?"

Icedrake-"I knew Kanye before all this, when he was dead broke and used to wear pink sweaters with snowflakes on them. He lived like 11 houses down from me. Every night, niggas would get up and either be at Kanye's crib or our crib, just working on ****".

XXL:"Why aren't you two cool anymore"?

Icedrake:I try to keep it like B.I.G. and just excel off my music, not controversy. At the same time, every time I speak on a situation, I'ma be real. We went to New York to try and get something poppin". We came back with some numbers from niggas. Kanye went behind my back and started creating relationships. This nigga bumped into Deric "D-Dot" Angelettie in New York and [sent] 49 beats to get signed-and he was sending our CDs. Kanye was signed with[Crazy Cat Catalog] for about four years, and about that time I got kicked out the crib, when I was like 15 years old. I had to hit the block to get my money, and Kanye was selling tracks. I was asking this nigga, "Why these niggas ain't checking me out?" Kanye's excat words to me:"Deric Angelettie said to turn your high-hats down and stop putting voices in the beat." That's the whole sound he gives Roc-A-Fella now. And the crazy **** is, when I met D-Dot, this nigga said, "I've never heard of your name in my life." Kanye's a dirty dude.

I believe I mentioned the government was just as wrong as bush was, mentioned it more than once actually. can't see past your own defense of your war-monger, idiot of a president eh.

btw, I find it funny that I never really heard you bash kanye until after he made the comment about bush. now you suddenly want to inflict bodily harm on him and everything else. very interesting.

"and he obviously doesn't care about black people because of his extremely slooow response along with the rest of the government, to this tragedy that affected mostly black people. "

that was the only thing i could find in referance to you mentioning any kind of government on a local level. even in that sentance you didnt specificaly state anything about local government. isnt the mayor of N.O. black? like i said before. if he would have said POOR instead of black it wouldnt be that big of an issue to me. even though it still would have been the wrong time and place to state that opinion. and about kanye. i just came back to this sight in july and kanye just came out with his new album. and again like i said before its not a boycott of his political views its a boycott of his character. if you can condemn bush for his actions then i can condemn kanye for his. im not the only one who feels this way. 4 of my friends so far feel the same way i do about kanye and have felt that way before he went on tv. and they are all black and hate bush as well. if i hear his music on the radio and it sounds good i will still listen but im not going to put any money in dudes pocket.


"btw, I find it funny that I never really heard you bash kanye until after he made the comment about bush. now you suddenly want to inflict bodily harm on him and everything else. very interesting. "

^^your making an assumption. assumption gets you no where.

originaly posted on futureproducers.com

So many people are beating up the government for the time it took to send aid to the Gulf Coast. I came across this article today and believe it is worth READING...
www.post-gazette.com/pg/05254/568876.stm

Jack Kelly: No shame
The federal response to Katrina was not as portrayed
Sunday, September 11, 2005

It is settled wisdom among journalists that the federal response to the devastation wrought by Hurricane Katrina was unconscionably slow.

Jack Kelly is national security writer for the Post-Gazette and The Blade of Toledo, Ohio (jkelly@post-gazette.com, 412-263-1476).

"Mr. Bush's performance last week will rank as one of the worst ever during a dire national emergency," wrote New York Times columnist Bob Herbert in a somewhat more strident expression of the conventional wisdom.

But the conventional wisdom is the opposite of the truth.

Jason van Steenwyk is a Florida Army National Guardsman who has been mobilized six times for hurricane relief. He notes that:

"The federal government pretty much met its standard time lines, but the volume of support provided during the 72-96 hour was unprecedented. The federal response here was faster than Hugo, faster than Andrew, faster than Iniki, faster than Francine and Jeanne."

For instance, it took five days for National Guard troops to arrive in strength on the scene in Homestead, Fla. after Hurricane Andrew hit in 1992. But after Katrina, there was a significant National Guard presence in the afflicted region in three.

Journalists who are long on opinions and short on knowledge have no idea what is involved in moving hundreds of tons of relief supplies into an area the size of England in which power lines are down, telecommunications are out, no gasoline is available, bridges are damaged, roads and airports are covered with debris, and apparently have little interest in finding out.

So they libel as a "national disgrace" the most monumental and successful disaster relief operation in world history.

I write this column a week and a day after the main levee protecting New Orleans breached. In the course of that week:

More than 32,000 people have been rescued, many plucked from rooftops by Coast Guard helicopters.

The Army Corps of Engineers has all but repaired the breaches and begun pumping water out of New Orleans.

Shelter, food and medical care have been provided to more than 180,000 refugees.

Journalists complain that it took a whole week to do this. A former Air Force logistics officer had some words of advice for us in the Fourth Estate on his blog, Moltenthought:

"We do not yet have teleporter or replicator technology like you saw on 'Star Trek' in college between hookah hits and waiting to pick up your worthless communications degree while the grown-ups actually engaged in the recovery effort were studying engineering.

"The United States military can wipe out the Taliban and the Iraqi Republican Guard far more swiftly than they can bring 3 million Swanson dinners to an underwater city through an area the size of Great Britain which has no power, no working ports or airports, and a devastated and impassable road network.

"You cannot speed recovery and relief efforts up by prepositioning assets (in the affected areas) since the assets are endangered by the very storm which destroyed the region.

"No amount of yelling, crying and mustering of moral indignation will change any of the facts above."

"You cannot just snap your fingers and make the military appear somewhere," van Steenwyk said.

Guardsmen need to receive mobilization orders; report to their armories; draw equipment; receive orders and convoy to the disaster area. Guardsmen driving down from Pennsylvania or Navy ships sailing from Norfolk can't be on the scene immediately.

Relief efforts must be planned. Other than prepositioning supplies near the area likely to be afflicted (which was done quite efficiently), this cannot be done until the hurricane has struck and a damage assessment can be made. There must be a route reconnaissance to determine if roads are open, and bridges along the way can bear the weight of heavily laden trucks.

And federal troops and Guardsmen from other states cannot be sent to a disaster area until their presence has been requested by the governors of the afflicted states.

Exhibit A on the bill of indictment of federal sluggishness is that it took four days before most people were evacuated from the Louisiana Superdome.

The levee broke Tuesday morning. Buses had to be rounded up and driven from Houston to New Orleans across debris-strewn roads. The first ones arrived Wednesday evening. That seems pretty fast to me.

A better question -- which few journalists ask -- is why weren't the roughly 2,000 municipal and school buses in New Orleans utilized to take people out of the city before Katrina struck?

"I think race is definitely a more prevalent force in the governments poor treatment and slow respnose to those people."

"I wouldn't even stop at saying bush doesn't care about black people. I would say the government doesn't care about black people"

"he obviously doesn't care about black people because of his extremely slooow response along with the rest of the government"

^^^go figure, you are talking about assumptions and you are the one who obviously is assuming what I said because there is no way you could have actually read my posts and missed all of those references to government

""btw, I find it funny that I never really heard you bash kanye until after he made the comment about bush. now you suddenly want to inflict bodily harm on him and everything else. very interesting. "

^^your making an assumption. assumption gets you no where.

^^^no assumptions at all, you never really talked shit about kanye before and the moment he says something bad about bush you say you want to "bitch slap him," lets not confuse assuming with stating the obvious

and still no clear referance to local government.

lol. this is kind of fun. my dislike for kanye didnt happen over night. did you read my post saying that im not even a huge fan of bush? eminems song mosh was nothing but a bush hate fest. and i still baught his cd.

"he obviously doesn't care about black people because of his extremely slooow response along with the rest of the government"

^the mayor is black. tell me the black mayor deosnt care about black people. and im asking again. are you talking about federal or local government? i cant read your mind thats why im asking. i didnt assume anything thats why im asking. i didnt know that asking a question was considered assuming.

i dont think you should be afraid to say a black mayor doesnt care about his people. the mayor of detroit is black and he could give a flying fuck about the people in his city. its awefully hypocritical to call a man racist when people of your own race in power dont care either.

gonna have to put the debate on hold. taking my second trip to las vegas this year and im leaving tomorrow. :FIRE:

I was talking about the federal government.

btw, I am very quick to notice when anyone doesn't care about a race whether it be theirs or not. What the hell can local government do when all of their resources are basically underwater. The mayor got on television just as irate as everyone else was that they weren't recieving help. Its hilarious to think that the local government could have really done much about that situation being that they too were in that area and they too were just as helpless as the other victims.

btw, your comment about how you love eminem and hate kanye though they both talk shit about your president can be taken many ways...but I won't throw out any assumptions on that matter, its on you.

another thing, I find it funny that you have to pull another, in your eyes "wrong" out of the bag (speaking of the mayor) who you claim didn't care about his people, to defend a man who you are trying to say isn't wrong...talk about hypocritcal. So let me get this straight, its untrue that bush doesn't care about black people, but it is true that the mayor doesn't care about black people...yet bush and the federal government had resources to help and the mayor obviously had no resources at all...but the only reason I don't blame the mayor is because he's black....LOL, this is great

have fun in vegas by the way.

"btw, your comment about how you love eminem and hate kanye though they both talk shit about your president can be taken many ways...but I won't throw out any assumptions on that matter, its on you"

^^thank you. i dont condemn kanye for what he said. only as a person. my point is that the mayor was offered help by amtrack to evacuate people. his response to this was he didnt get the message. he had plenty of resources and transportation and didnt use them. i never said bush wasnt wrong. i think blaming the president is an easy out.

", I find it funny that you have to pull another, in your eyes "wrong" out of the bag (speaking of the mayor) who you claim didn't care about his people, to defend a man who you are trying to say isn't wrong...talk about hypocritcal. So let me get this straight, its untrue that bush doesn't care about black people, but it is true that the mayor doesn't care about black people...yet bush and the federal government had resources to help and the mayor obviously had no resources at all...but the only reason I don't blame the mayor is because he's black....LOL, this is great"

^^im only stating that it is possible to be black and not care about your people. same goes with white people. im blaming both federal and local government. so you place no blame on the government of LA? you cant prove bush doesnt care about black people and you cant prove that the mayor of N.O. does care about black people.


"yet bush and the federal government had resources to help and the mayor obviously had no resources at all...but the only reason I don't blame the mayor is because he's black....LOL, this is great"

^the mayor had plenty of resources and i stated them. if you choose not to see that your not being very fair.

on another note


Hopefully this trip to vegas wont break me like the last one. this time im not playing anything i cant stick a quarter into. lol

p.s

kanye now says white people shouldnt be allowed to use slang until that word is at least a year old.

^^you gotta be fricken kidding me right?

I am a very fair person and I don't approve of any one discriminating against another no matter what the color either of the parties are, and I am very aware that there are people who discriminate against their own race and find that just as ignorant and unacceptable as someone discriminating against another race. As far as the mayor having help handed to him and not accepting, I simply was unaware of that, if I knew that I would not ignore it believe me. And if that is the case, then I agree, he too, does not care about the victims, of which the majority of are black.

on another note...hopefully you come back from vegas a millionare, and if you do, don't forget your online fam, lol

btw, did kanye really make that comment about white people and slang? and if so, where can I find the source?

^^i totally agree with you. yay i think we can come to terms on this. good discussion. thanks for keepin me on my toe's Ill.

as far as those comments kanye made about slang. i read it on another message board yesterday and passed it off as rumor. but last night on adam carolla's show on comedy central they quoted him as saying such. him and an actor from the chapelle show discussed it. if i find a source to a website then i will post it.

i doubt i'll come back from vegas a millionare but i can hope. id just be happy winning a 100 dollars. at least it would pay for drinks for a night. lol.

http://www.contactmusic.com/new/xmlfeed.ns...n%20slang%20use

this is just one source and i honestly dont know how credible they are but do a google search and you can find it pretty easy. this was the quote on adam carolla's show last night.

tru, thanks for keeping me on my toes too, best debate I had in a while.

i found this funny quiz. its kind of interesting. it calculates a percentage of how republican you are.

http://paulkienitz.net/republican.html

i came out as 60% republican. im not rush!!!!! dodged that bullet. lol.

and Ill i know i contradicted myself when i said i wasnt going to argue but im glad i did. although i still read the newspaper and what not i think ive been kind of living in my own world and starting to forget about everyone else. but this conversation got me thinking and paying more attention to whats going on. im not always on the republican side of the fence and i dont vote republican for the sake of voting republican. my republican views are based mostly on economic and buisiness related agenda's. i grew up with a republican family and some of them have done very well for themselves. and because of this i see that everyone around them, wether they be family or friends, have benefited. we can all agree that if somehow you are put in a position to help your friends and family than by all means you should do it.

peace, love, and happiness to you and Ill talk to yall when i get back.

yeah, I don't down anyone for their political views, I only down the people who have those views and have no idea why they do and couldn't tell you if you asked them. You obviously don't fit into that category.

Have a safe trip and I hope you have fun and don't come back with empty pockets, lol.