I want to get a highend pistol. I just don't know what one. They will both cost roughly the same amount because of the magazines for the 8.

Since I play mostly speed-ball, the 8 might be better because its lighter and quicker to reload. Once the magazines are all emptied I think they are harder to reload than a top-tube. I dont have gorilla hands either so it kind of weird to grip.

The micro will be a little slower to reload, but not have to worry about dropping a mag on the ground, just a tube. More heft - stediar shots. I would have to change 12 grams more often though. It has a smaller grip that is esiar for me to hold too.

Either way im gonna be rockin the 50 with a pistol soon. :pow:

KungFuHampster,
If money were no object I would argue that a microsquall stroker with an 'RP' style feed and a dropout 12gram fasstchanger would be the deadliest engine ever to ride in one hand.
The 'RP'(named after RamboPreacher) style is simple, sliding the ball pusher and spring back opens a gate in the top of the feed tube.
So you slide back the spring, pour the balls in, release the spring.
Fewer steps=less time.
It's so much faster than loading a tag8 or a standard pistol that it's just ridiculous. I have my zeus set up this way and I won't ever change back to loading paint into a rear gate, period, and it only requires ten round tubes. I don't know how well it worked on RamboPreacher's rifle but for a pistol, it's well worth the extra hundred some it will cost you. You'd save that hundred dollars back the first two mags for the tag8 you didn't buy

This gun would eliminate steps for loading co2 and paint, thereby reducing your chance of being eliminated yourself, and perform as well as any pistol ever made.

Unfortunately for me, money is an object, or I'd be able to post a picture of this gun :vangry:

Someday...


Rob

Sadly, money is an object. I'm not going to be able to get either of these till I sell my bko. I'll probably use an old style pgp for the conversion, and was wondering if palmers did anything to make changing the 12 gram with the stock changer any easiar. If not I might get a custom tool made that has a handle and slides into the slit, so I can have more leverage while turning it (I can do it with bare hands, but that would make it quicker). If it gets roughly 20 shots per 12 gram (slow) I think I'd be all set anyways.

They have the quicksilver lever changer but current 12grams all vary in length so badly that many people are staying with the 3turn fasst changer and a dropout.

My piercing plug on my zeus has a 'wrench' like you're thinking of.
(here's a decent picture)
http://us.st11.yimg.com/store1.yimg.com/I/...ot_1880_1443241

It slides out of the end and pokes into the holes spaced around the plug. It works so well, you have to be careful not to overtighten.
I was thinking of the 2K1 PGP for that RP feed, it uses up the tube a bit more, you might only get 6 or 7 shots instead of the 8 that are usual with an old model.

ROb

I don't think im gonna get a drop out, looks better w/o one. Do you think there is enough meat on the stock plug to drill a small hole in, and use a small peice of metal to tighten it (same idea as the zeus)?

Is the old style or cartridge valve better for conversions also?

I know what you mean about the looks of the dropout but remember, 99% of the times threads get damaged it's when you're starting them, not once you've already got the plug on and are tightening it(especially under fire!). The dropout means you never have to take the plug out all the way which means less wear on your threads, no fumbling to get threads started while people are shooting at you and generally a faster operation to reload. I was concentrating on pure efficiency and speed which favor the dropout.

My plug on my P68SC is steel so it would be strong enough for a zeus style wrench even though it's hollowed out. the insta-pierce is also a good option to get, eliminating the need to dry fire a first shot to pierce the 12g.


As for the valve, I think one of them gives you one less ball in the magazine, but can't remember which one for the life of me. :wacko:

Rob

valve dosen't matter, they replace it wiht their own, as for the best pgp, its all personal preferance. a 2k1 pgp will give you 10 shots a pre 2k1 will give you 8 unless you get it rebarreled.

I play speedball format with my squall (in my sig) all the time. However, I have opted for a HPA rig w/ fem.stab and lapco drop fwd through a dummy 12g. Loading is no problem as i only need to reload once at most....although the RP springfeed rig is trick and has caught my eye.

If you don't mind the weight and won't be holstering it, I suggest the full sized squall over the micro....I find greater range in the longer barrel without sacraficing much on profile.

FastChange is ok....but I had getting a true seal and ended days with bloody blistered thumb pads. The second downside is shootdown. Operating pressure for a squall is around 650psi.....if you squeeze a double tap or two, you will get just enough shootdown to affect accuracy.

Being a double tapper myself and anal regarding my accuracy, I opted out of the co2 completely and went with stab and hpa....my rig is solid as a rock and I can pound out the entire 10ball springfeed onto a fence post (or some poor speedballer's exposed foot) at 30yds w/o trying==no shootdown, it's "rock" solid.

I know it's not what you want to hear regarding your pistol dreams, but it's reality. I was not willing to sacrifice shootdown and range/longball accuracy that's why i went with the rig....and couldn't be happier

good luck in your choice.

btw, Tac8 looks sweet but i swear by palmer brass :D

This little beast should arrive at my door by Thursday. I'll let you know how she performs. My guess is wonderful... :D

Another option is this type of rig:


That's a RAP4 30gram tank on my zeus, allowing a small expansion chamber in the 12g chamber. It gets 50-60 shots(not hosed in the picture).
This would work well on a squall, in fact I thought it would be cool to replace the bottom tube with an ASA for these, in a fullsize squall you could use the 9" 45gram. Their downside is price, $50 apop plus most fields won't fill them(I piggyback mine off of a 20oz with a standard fill rig) because they don't have a standard burst disk.

Fun, though heavy.

Rob

I think I'd be okay with 12 grams, since the speedball feilds I play at are kind of small, and I play front. I would probably use this for rec mostly too, I dont see too many renters moving up and bunkering people. I've seen some people have the orginal pump handle on their Micros+Strokers, how do they keep them on without connecting the pump rod? Set screws?

I was thinking about it at work last night, and I decided that I am giong to get a drop out changer. That way, I can hook up a mini cocker asa to a dummy 12 gram (if possible) and run a vert 3.5 ouncer.

That would work. however you will find a better balance with a small df mounted backwards and run your 3.5 there with a hose or hard line to the dummy 12g. Plus it leaves it as a holsterable gun.

as for changing 12 grams comparing a zeus and a stock pgp2k1, the pgp is much easier to turn compared to the zeus because it pieces when you pump the marker, the zeus pieces as you twist so you need the level to crank it a bit. a drop out would be nice but its still very fast without one. Personally i would love to convert my pgp but thats really expensive, one day though, my only concern still is rollouts, can pps install wedgits on a pgp?

yes they can put wedgeits in the PGP ...