Cabinet has spent a lot of time discussing the issue of what happens when a Minister steps down from Cabinet (may it be by their own accord or any other issue that would remove them from Cabinet). We are now coming to you, the members of the region, to ask your opinion.

Please vote in the above poll and then reply with a response below telling us what your feelings are and any ideas that you have. Your time and answers are greatly appriciated and will help shape this Non-Crappy region further.

Thanks,

The Canadian Cabinet

Glossary:

VoC = Vote of Confidence

Am I correct in the assumption that elected officials get their VOC by being elected, and that appointed officials would be put up for a VOC as soon as they were appointed if the second choice is rattified?

New glossary item:

privilages = priviliges.

That is what I would like to see: a change where a DM goes up for a VoC following their selection, and not as an emergency measure because they have to go into service.

Keeping in mind that a DM could still be dismissed by the Minister, and that a new selection to replace a "fired" DM would pass their own VoC.

:lol:

"privileges"

I am not comfortable with someone who is chosen by one person getting admin. privileges. I voted for the second choice.

You would be correct if you said "This will confuse 420_Celebrants".

Members elected by the members are automatically given the vote of confidence.

Interim members (Deputies stepping up or appointments, etc.) would need a vote of confidence from the region to gain the administrators powers.

I believe this answers it ... either way it has confused me more.

Your confusion has produced my clarity. Thanks.

I too would like to see the Deputy Minister pass a VoC as soon as they are selected. Then, there would be no question that they are trusted by the region, and they would not have to go through what I went through as interim MoD.

As it stands, if I understand the question and legislation correctly, when a Minister is elected to office they automatically pass the Vote of Confidence. If a Deputy Minister needs to be elevated to the position of what would have been an elected Cabinet position that carries administrative priviliges they are required to pass a Regional Vote of Confidence.

However, Appointed Officials, such as maintainence of the Regional Map or NSWiki would not need a vote of Confidence as they do not carry Administrative priviliges and are incredibly important volunatry positions.

If, on the other hand an Appointed Official is also a Deputy Minister and there is the need to elevate them to a Cabinet position with Admin priviliges then yes - they will be required to undergo a Regional Vote of Confidence.

For the remainder of the current cabinet term.

That could work. The only problem is if the Deputy Minsiter needs to be elevated to a position that carries Admin priviliges. Even though they have passed a Regional Vote of Confidence to become a Deputy Minsiter, they would still be requried to pass the Regional Vote of Confidence to be granted Admin priviliges.

Perhaps, in light of this conversation, a review of the current legislation is needed.

As it stands now when the deputy is elevated they are granted the FULL portfolio of the Minister as an intermin Minister. If that includes admin powers they are given them. The following Thursday after their elevation they are up for a VoC to see if they will continue to permentally hold the Minister portfolio.
There are a few days in there that they are granted the portfolio before the VoC.
Which means if that portfolio carried admin powers they have them before the VoC.

I don't feel anyone should hold admin powers before a regional VoC is held.

I would even go for granting them mod. powers to do the job as intermin Minister but not admin. powers until after the VoC.

So, we have elections and then as the ministers choose their dm's, we have a VoC for each dm... Oui?

That certainly appears how the discussion is panning out.

or once elevated they receive mod powers but no admin until after the VoC.

I am leaning towards VoC asap after deputies are chosen, then if they need to be elevated they already have the VoC to take over that Minister position.

This approach is certainly more practical.

By this logic, they only recieve the Vote of Confidence for becoming a Deputy Minsiter. The issue at hand is the Vote of Confidence for Ministerial positions with Admin status -- and as the process is two separate stages, would it be better to require a separate Vote of Confidence? Admittedley, this scenario would require two separate Votes of Confidence (one for becoming a Deputy Minsiter and one for retaining Admin status). In essence, what is being propsosed here is a vote before there is the need for one.

I was thinking that the incoming dm's would have a VoC for admin. powers in the event they had to take over for a minister. That way there is no gap in time where we have one or possibly more admin's missing.

Opps :( I mean't to vote for the bottom one but I voted for the top one by mistake. :( :(

Exactly it would be a VoC to be able to be elevated if need be. I don't see a need for a VoC to be deputy and a VoC to also be elevated.

I agree about one VoC. As soon after the deputy is appointed, the deputy should go up for a Vote of Confidence, which would carry over until the next election or the deputy is elevated.

I agree with the second option.

<mav> um...BP shouldn't be able to vote on this...

EDIT: ah. iCan't...iCan view it... :wall:

If the Deputy Minister is appointed for a position that would hold Admin powers if he/she was promoted during the term, this should also be written into the initial vote.

Example-Vote of Confidence for Deputy MoD would include the fact that, "if promoted to Minister for any reason, the Deputy would also take the entire portfolio of MoD, including admin powers"...

then, if the VoC is passed, it is done with the knowledge that there is the chance that the Deputy would one day hold these powers.

Like this? ey?

Actually, that is probably too easy of an answer. We need to come up with something convoluted, involving at least 2 or three separate votes over a 2 month time span, interspersed with random drug testing and a DNA sample placed on file in case something should go terribly wrong. Maybe even throw a couple of intentional loop holes into the mix so a smart nation could circumvent something, causing another crisis and keeping us all talking about something.... :lol:

Sorry Shay, but yours is just too simple and easy to understand and implement. Very un-governmental, ya know..... ;)

Gee thanks, I love you too! :P

Whats love got ta do with it......? :huh:

We just would not want to do something too simple that everyone could understand and that could be done without a whole lot of questions and waiting around....

Then people might have too much time to really ENJOY to forum! :lol:

Now this is Liarg in fine form. Great post! :lol:

Now seriously, I think the way the bill is written looks good. If an understanding is made on the first VoC why would we need to have some kind of do-over. I like the idea of doing the VoC quickly after elections.

My only concern is the opening sentence "Upon winning an election...". How does "Upon being elected to office..." sound?

Sounds better to me Carb....
But then 420 hasn't pipped in yet with his editing expertise ;)

420 is a consummate professional when it comes to editing.

I did my editing in Cabinet :)

Your proposed change sounds good to my journalistic ears Carb.

Anyone here have anything else to add?