A South Pacific Nation, called "chickenpants" proposed the following UN resolution, entitled "End the Canadian Problem"

Description: The Canadians have been entering the societys of all of our Nations. They have Currupted the national governments of all member Nations. The Canadians, With there leafs, must be put into seperation camps. All of our economys are suffering under these Canadians and we must end the problem. In fact this could Actually help the economys of all memeber nations by having the Canadians produce cheap product while they attend the Seperation Camps. Anyone that is at least 1/8 Canadian will be considered Canadian and will be sent to the Camps.
We Must end the Canadian problem before it gets out of hand.

I immediately wrote to LadyRebels, Delegate of the SP, stating how disappointed I was that someone in her region would write such a heinous proposal.

My gut reaction is get cabinet to discuss breaking off all ties with the SP. However, prior to doing that, I am going to await LadyRebels' response to my expression of outrage.

I would only support breaking relations with the SP as a last resort. I suspect this to be an action of a rogue state. Rogue states can appear within any region. I would urge you to maintain communications with the SP delegate as long as possible. Having said that, if LadyRebels does not repudiate this heinous act, there may be no choice but to sever ties.

The Drunken Hoser military will be on 24-hour alert status, until this crisis has passed. We hope to avoid a confrontation, but will defend our homeland if provoked.

I agree that we should await Lady rebels response, however IMHO the only response from this nation should be full outrage and full cooperation to deal with chickenparts. anything short of that tn I believe we should breal off all ties with the SP.

This should be brought up with NS mods as there may not be anything offensive it may border on something illegal in the game.

Mostly disturbing. I'll make sure that Boardz is informed as soon as possible. I had a look at the UN proposals while typing this and couldn't see it - perhaps mods/admin removed it following Micon's response. Even if (in the worse case scanrio) it did make it thorough to the vote, I can imagine the results not being pleasant in the UN, or rest of the world for that matter. Perhaps, if relations with the South Pacific are to be maintained, it could be requested that Chickenpants be repremanded severely within the South Pacific or Canada.
Naturally, a Canadian Delegation would be sent to oversee and contribute.

Does it really look like it will come to this though?

It seems to be quite poorly written only making one [/I]real[I] sentient argument (if it even is), about four times - talk about hammering your point across! I am concerned about it though, and wonder what the appropriate course of action to follow would be. :huh:

Well, Boardz is our contact to the South Pacific....someone should also mention this to Promise of Joshua.

It's just a shame he's kind of AWOL presently.

I told PoJ. He's offered an appology. Just now, I made the following demands:

We have a thread in "international incidents" called "controversial UN proposal" about the proposal in question. You can post there.

Only two nations have endorsed chickenpants, However one of them is your sitting delegate. That doesn't sit well with us to say the least.

Ideally, I'd want chickenpants ejected from your region. However, I recognize that you likely have processes and regulations over that.

At the very least, we demand the following ultimatum:

We want an appology posted on these forums and the SP forums from chickenpants, with a promise that they will never promote hatred against Canadians or any other group again. We want this done by 11:00 p.m. Eastern Time, March 2, 2004.

If those conditions are not fulfilled by that time, we demand that chickenpants either be ejected, or if your internal regulations require something more prior to ejection, a full blown trial to determine whether chickenpants' should be ejected.

I thank you for your attention to this matter.

It is quite possible that the sitting delegate has a policy of endorsing all UN nations in the region. I truly believe that the actions of chickenpants are not endorsed by the other members of the SP, and that we should continue to treat this as the actions of a rogue nation.

"It is quite possible that the sitting delegate has a policy of endorsing all UN nations in the region."

That would seem likely Canadiiya, unless there are underlying motives. I think that Bweezy's suggesstion:

"We want an appology posted on these forums and the SP forums from chickenpants..."

as humiliation is a far better deterent that ejection (unless no other alternative is available), as it would hopfeully dissuade from a similar experience.
Our very own Bweezy endorses most Nations here. I thought that you needed two endorsements to submit a proposal. I think the question that we should be asking is: Has the sitting Delegate approved this proposal? If that is the case, then there are definately issues to be dealt with here.

I don't disagree with that statement. However, this rogue nation must be dealt with swiftly and decisively. I'm still awaiting a response from LadyRebels. I can tell you that I'm growing increasingly impatient.

This is bulls*it. Where the hell do they come up wit this stuff. I'm willing to do whatever it takes to end this - just let me know

Thanks Axasia - the longer I get ignored by the SP's delegate, the more rage I feel. If we are truly that insignificant to them, I am starting to openly wonder why we bother to maintain diplomatic ties with them.

It is quite possible that the delegate is otherwise occupied at the moment.

I was just in the SP main forums. She's there, online as we speak. She's around, but just not addressing us.

EDIT - Actually, that's not true - she was there 15 minutes ago. I just went back, and she has since logged out.

No she's there again (added later)...
"If we are truly that insignificant to them, I am starting to openly wonder why we bother to maintain diplomatic ties with them."
If this is the case, and your impatience grows Bweezy, I guess it's time to test the convictions of the SP's alliance, and how far they are willing to go.
If it turns out for the worst, I guess that will have to be dealt with if (and when) it happens. Rather than an open conflict, perhaps a more intellectal resolution may be countered. If it's open war though, I guess they'll just have to be resolute enough to thier convictions as this is blatently un-just as well as standing against the entire premis of the United Nations. Especially from a major-power and birth-Region.
It's just not cricket! :angry:

If open conflict was to happen between us and the SP, it would be a large fight. SP is a formidable region on thier own, not to mention their allies. On the other hand, Canada is a very popular region, and has many regions who would come to their defense. (Vancouver, Manitoba, Newfoundland (if they still exist), Alberta, North America, British Columbia, Victoria, Okanogan, Wysteria, The Five Pacifics (if they still exist), NationStates, NationStates 2, maybe even the US... Plus the mods.)

Also, I think the mods would be quick to help, though the amount of nations being deleted would be amazing....

yes well, let us hope that we wont have to give them a call, im sure most of you, much like myself, would like this to be resolved in a peaceful manner

There won't be a conflict - the worst that will happen is we will close our embassy in the SP, and eject their ambassadors from our region.

Still waiting word from the SP...

This was just posted on our NS forum by LadyRebels:

To: The Noble Region of Canada

From: The Delegate of the South Pacific

I moved here quickly to post an apology to everyone over what the nation of Chickenpants did in the UN, I hope that you will accept this apology and I have removed my endorsment from that Nation.

I did not know what they were doing, and I would never have endorsed them if I had known.

They are getting an offical warning on the off site boards as well. I hear as well that the Delegate Telegrammed me about this matter.

I apologize now for the oversight, but I never did read that telegram or I would have moved faster on it, I do recieve a lot of telegrams, and I always have 15 when I get online, the newest ones sent also bump the oldest ones.

I hope that this somehow straightens things out for you and your Region. I also hope that we can still speak to each other through Diplomatic ties.

Respectfully,
The Queen of LadyRebels
Delegate of the South Pacific
By Grace of the South Pacific Nations

She appears to have ignored our key demands - an appology or expulsion of ChickenPants, which were the demands we made to Promise of Joshua, and which were allegedly communicated to the proper authorities.

I fear this response, while well intentioned, may only inflame things.

Ugh.

Posting here from a South Pacific point of view (please don't hate me, I'm a good guy).

My main nation (Fudgetopia) is currently Secretary of the Region. I was alerted to this situation by a dear friend, who was very annoyed about the situation. I was appalled that this had even happened, and moved directly to the channels to get something happening.

The delegate, LadyRebels, had not recieved the Telegram in question. She apologises profusely and is as shocked and hurt as I am.

Chickenpants has been formally warned by myself, with a request to formally apologise to your regions. Unfortunately, it is impossible to enforce that he does come over and do this. Bearing that in mind, our delegate is truly sorry that this happened. She has formally apologised on behalf of the South Pacific.

As much as this sounds like an excuse, it is virtually impossible to monitor all the actions of every action in the South Pacific. We are 8000 nations plus, and whilst we try to have big brother watching, sometimes one housemate will slipp through the leash and casue problems like this.

I ask all Canadians, to consider my words, and hopefully together we can continue to work out a solution to this problem. The nations of the South Pacific have not forgotten the kindness shown to them in our recent invasion by Savage Lands.
Rest assured that the wheels are in motion in the cabinet, and that actions are being taken.

Please feel free to contact me.

I mentioned on the Regional Notice Board a swift response would have been greatly appreciated. A slow response is better than no response I guess though. It still doesn't add credence, justify, or excuse what has been done. Or more accurately, the act of reasoning (if any), behind the submission.

"I do recieve a lot of telegrams..."

What has this got to do with the price of Fish and Chips. I'm not wanting to cause aggrovation or provoke an unwanted response, but this is not an excuse for not checking Telegrams.

"If open conflict was to happen between us and the SP, it would be a large fight.".

I agree Oilers Fans, the results would not be pleasant, but am reassured by Bweezy's post that this will not be the case. A Diplomatic resolution would be much more lucrative to both sides. I appreciate that you are a large Region Daasfnord, but some kind of policy in place to filter UN Proposals would be a good idea. If, for example, it had targeted another Pacific Region, the rammications could be insurmountable and throw the Pacific rim into turmoil. Although I doubt this would happen somehow.

I think a show of distaste sould be offered quickly and decisivel; but nothing that can be interpreted as an outward show of hostility. Perhaps limits being set to intelligence sharing (if any), audiences in the Canadian Ebmassy by appointment only, and those issues brought to the Embassy being discussed in an open forum of Canada's members if they would have direct consequences, no matter how small, upon Canada's Regional Sovereignty.
It certainly is a delicate situation to be stuck inside of.

Your comments are appreciated, Carbanousa.

When I formally posted the warning to Chickenpants, our Secretary of Justice immediately recommended that a vote on expulsion take place. This is currently at a vote for 48 hours, and by all accounts will be a unanimous vote.

Your suggestion for monitioring UN proposals is admirable, but, unfortunately, we cannot enforce such a policy. We do try for more active forum representation, however, once again, in a region of 8000+ nations it is difficult to monitor everyone 24 hours a day. Filtering UN proposals would be a difficult task even in a region of 100 people.

We are actively working towards a resolution, however due to the democracy of our region, we are tied until the vote is ended.

Eloquently put Daasfnord. I understand that the administration of such a large Region would be extremely difficult. Your apology explanation is accepted gratiously and I sincerely hope that the vote is unanimous.
I will however, stand by my fellow Canadians' decision regarding this matter and hope that our relations with the South Pacific are left intact.

I read daasnforth's response late last night. I did not respond right away, as I did not want to inflame situations further. To be short and to the point, I was pissed off over this whole situation.

Sadly, I have to say that after a good night's rest, that feeling has not changed.

My concern here is not mainly with the fact that the proposal was made. Much like I cannot control what kind of UN proposals are submitted by any of the 260 other nations in the region, I do not hold LadyRebels or the south pacific government personally responsible for ChickenPants' decision to post the inflammatory proposal.

What I am concerned about here is the South Pacific's response to the fact that the proposal was made.

Lets recap, this event from our point of view, shall we?

1. At 11:00 eastern or so, I noticed the proposal. I was horrified. I was even more horrified when I noticed the region of origin of ChickenPants. I immediately notified LadyRebels via telegram. I PM'd Promise of Joshua, the SP's ambassardors on these boards voicing similar concerns.

2. 12 hours later, several members of this region saw LadyRebels frolicking about her regional boards, all the while ignoring our telegram.

3. Promise of Joshua did PM me with a token appology and proposed course of action. He asked if there was anything more that could be done. I took that opportunity to demand an appology by CP on the SP and Canada boards by 11:00 p.m. Eastern, March 2, 2004, failing that, he would be ejected by the SP, or if that was illegal in the SP, that a trial, vote, etc., take place concerning his ejection.

4. In response to this, Promise of Joshua sent me a rude and terse response criticizing me for making demands. Notwithstanding that Promise of Joshua himself had openned the door to these demands, he felt necessary to be very rude, and to further inflame the situation. In response, I sent Promise of Joshua a terse response stating that:
- it was our region that was wronged by a nation in the SP
- that if one of our nations posted a proposal demanding the enslavement of members of the SP (or any other region) in a concentration camp, he or she would be ejected immediately; and
- that it was not unreasonable for Canada to expect the same treatment from the SP with regard to hatemongers.

5. Finally, after being ignored for 27 hours, we did received an appology from ladyrebels, and then a visit from daasfnord.

However, in all of this, not one person has yet officially addressed our demands, that being an apology by March 2, 11:00 p.m., failing this, ejection of ChickenPants from the SP or a trial/vote on the matter.

We are still waiting for a straight response on our only demands on the matter. How hard is it to get a straight answer from the South Pacific? This is like pulling teeth.

All in all, the SP either looks like a nation that doesn't care about Canada, or is simply too disorgnized to bother addressing Canadian needs. Either way, the SP does not look good to us right now.

Further, I need to state the obvious. Canada, compared to the SP, is very small. We have 261 nations. Unliked the SP with 8,000 nations, it takes a huge amount of our resources to cultivate relations with regions. We simply don't have the resources to open ties with most regions.

By choosing to pursue diplomatic relations with the South Pacific, we are excluding other, equally large and equally important regions from our diplomatic efforts. We have to pick and choose our diplomatic relations carefully. We just can't open up an embassy in every region we'd like.

I have to suggest, openly and publicly, that I wonder if Canada would be better off seeking diplomatic relations with a better organized and more responsive region than the South Pacific at this time. Ultimately, that decision will be up to Cabinet.

While I appreciate the recent strides made by daasfnord in resolving the situation, all in all, this whole fiasco has definately damaged the relationship between our two regions, and I openly wonder if the relationship is worth salvaging.

Lastly, as the final insult, I could not help but notice that there is some vocal opposition to calls for ChickenPants' expulsion on the South Pacific's boards. I find it absolutely abhorrent that there are people in the South Pacific who think it is ok for a nation in the South Pacific to write up a proposal calling for all Canadians to be rounded up and put in Nazi-era concentration camps. This type of attitude further leads me to believe that further diplomatic relations between our two regions should cease.

Clearly, if this tacit approval of ChickenPants' conduct by citizen nations of the SP is any indication, Canada and the SP do not share common values, and perhaps should not bother sharing diplomatic relationships.

This will be discussed by Cabinet in the coming days. We will inform everyone of our decision once the debate has subsided.

In accordance with our laws, Chickenpants has been officially warned. Our secretary of justice also moved that we make and official ejection for treason. This, also subject to vote, has gone to vote for 48 hours.

I posted this just above your last post, Bweezy.

I also recieved a rather rude message back from Chickenpants regarding my warning. He has refused to apologise. Unfotunately for him this moves against him

Thank you for your efforts, daasfnord. Although I am certainly coming off as an angry sort (because I am), your efforts are appreciated, and I thank you for them.

These are the thoughts of Freedom Fighter, posted in public for all to see in the SP Boards. Freedom Fighter, if I am not mistaken, has a Cabinet post in the SP:

Do the Canadiens have a right to be pissed off at Chickenpants? Absolutly. Do they have the right to be pissed off at the SP? No way. A warning should be given to Chickenpants, not expulsion yet. How dare the Canadiens try to dictate to us how to run our region!! This is an internal problem and is really none of their damn business.

*shakes head*

*notes to self that she should really get to bed after this post*

You neglected to post that directly underneath that there was an objection along hte lines of

"Taking that on board FF, how do we deal with the situation? Do we leave Chckenpants alone to make more inflammatory comments, and lose a strong ally because they feel we condone those actions?"

Thanks for the context, D. I didn't feel it was necessary, given that Freedom Fighter has not retracted his statement. However, feel free to supplement this thread with whatever posts from the SP boards you feel are necessary. They are always welcome.

I'd like to point out some differences in culture and background. Canada is a very tolerant nation, and has enshrined tolerance to the point that publishing hate literature is a crime. Many other democratic regions have chosen not to censor publication of anything, but rather to defend freedom of speech, even when the contents of that speech is hateful. It appears that ChickenPants is assuming that he has the right of free speech. It further appears that FreedomFighter is defending the right to free speech of a citizen nation of his region.

Given the right to free speech, we cannot assume that the SP's response is condoning ChickenPants. Instead, they are working within their legal system to deal with things. What CP has done is not a crime - it is an abhorrent exercise of free speech.

In Canada, on the other hand, it would be a crime. That is why we in Canada are so outraged.

I suggest a cooling-off period, and some understanding of the value others place on the right to free speech.

Saskatonia

[OOC] I'm a Canadian living in the US, and this has brought me up short several times.

[QUOTE] This is an internal problem and is really none of their damn business. /QUOTE]

Ya we do have a right to be pissed off. It is our business if the SP cannot control or deal with the nations in their region when are exchaging diplomats.

In the context of Real Life we as "insert your country" would be more than pissed off if one of our most trusted allies decided to push out legislation to send our citizens to concentration camps blah, blah, blah.

Based on the above quote I am even more pissed off than before and this is after a cooling off period.

Maybe I am off base but that is how i feel.

"By choosing to pursue diplomatic relations with the South Pacific, we are excluding other, equally large and equally important regions from our diplomatic efforts." (Quoted from Bweezy)

I think that this is fast becoming the only real alternative. It would be an idea to enquire whether we could maintain informal relations. At least that way, if an opportunity whereby an SP alliance would be beneficial, it's not an impossibility.

"We have to pick and choose our diplomatic relations carefully. We just can't open up an embassy in every region we'd like." (Quoted from Bweezy)

Also very true. If the relations with SP were kept to an informal basis, it could lead to the reassignment of the acting Ambassador with a view to promote a possible diplomatic relations with other region.

"I suggest a cooling-off period..." (Quoted from Saskationia)
I agree. Perhaps this 'cooling off periods' could be used to pursue diplomatic relations with other regions.

It would be a shame in the short-term, but the dividend potential is honestly attractive with other regions. I must say as a final note here that it does seem unlikely that we shall recieve an apology and will have to plan the next move.

This above is the response that I sent to bweezy regarding his demands. I apologize for not responding until this point but rl concerns have kept me busy and away from a computer. My own misunderstanding led me to the NS international incidents forum this morning and only just now found out about this thread. I apologize to you all for being rather dense on that.

I suspected that rl concerns may have kept our government from making a timely response and was, frankly, trying to buy time. If it had been within my power to eject chickenpants; he would have been gone posthaste. That not being the fact, I notified the powers that be and suggested very reasonably that while you may agree with a course of action, you may not want to be dictated to regarding it.

I think events bear me out on that point. Chickenpants will be ejected by an overwhelming, if not unanomous, vote in the South Pacific. From what I see, the only reason why this may not be unanomous in the insistance of dictating policy of how The South Pacific deals with our own problems(back to what I suggested last night) Again, I think the same dynamic would be operative here if the roles were reversed although I do agree with, and understand, your very justifiable anger for a host of reasons.

Canada will not be ignored as the South Pacific values our relationship. RL (in my case) sometimes gets in the way of a timely response and for that I can only apologize. I will also apologize if any of comments were(or are) taken to mean any disrespect as none is intended.

Peace

A nation named "Harkinnen" made this post in the SP:

I can see why you are so frustrated LR. My opinion is that nations in our region are free to express whatever views they want in the onsite forum, even if they are offensive. It is not up to you, or anyone else on this forum, to censor the inhabitants of our region in what they post there. If something is out of line on this forum, then we are to take action according to our laws. If it is on the NS forum, it is up to the moderators to correct the problem. I am not condoning the offending nation's actions, but if we are going to punish this nation for speaking his mind, we are both operating outside our jurisdiction and stifling free speech.

If the region of Canada cannot understand this, they do not deserve to call themselves our ally. I dont know where their delegate gets the idea he can dictate to us what we do with our citizens.

That seals the deal for me. I will be voting in favour of terminating diplomatic relations with the South Pacific when the matter goes to a vote starting March 2.

I can understand your feelings on the matter.

Frankly, I just voted in favor of banning Chickenpants per the South Pacific Charter.

I can say that Harkinnen has no role whatsoever in the South Pacific Government and should in no way be viewed as having any authority to represent our views on this or any matter.

I again offer our sincere apologies for the injury done your region and can report that the NS mods have been contacted by our government about chickenpants' responses to us in this.

PoJ is now misrepresenting me on the SP boards. He has taken one of my comments out of context. I made a reference to sending a PM to LadyRebels at "11:00 Eastern". This was in reference to 11:00 p.m. eastern time on Saturday Night.

Now, PoJ is apparently misrepresenting that comment as meaning 11:00 p.m. eastern time on Sunday night, and stating that they've only known about this for 20 hours.

That's 24 hours less than the reality.

They are now misrepresenting us on their boards, and covering up their own misdeeds.

I've had it. I've never been more pissed off at anything in Nation States as I am with the half-truths and misdeeds of the SP's representative to our region.

In light of the lies being spread by PoJ, I'm calling an emergency vote immediately in the Cabinet area on the future of our ties with the SP.

Bweezy, Harkinnen really does have nothing to with their region, they have a poll to ban him as well, and the majority want to do so.

I'd like to explain why I'm against cutting ties with the SP:

The SP has taken steps towards dealing with chickenpants, it's not like they completely ignored the problem. It's their prerogative to deal with the nation in keeping with thier laws. If their system takes longer than the time we alotted them, that's fine, the problem is still being dealt with. It's the SP's duty to follow their own laws in these matters and have a vote on the ban; however long it may take, as long as the issue is being addressed. In all honesty, I don't think that a deadline should have been made for chickenpants ejection, as an ally of the SP we shouldn't force them to change their laws. They are in no way endorsing this nation, no one there believes what he said was okay, and the majority are in favour of banning him. I don't see why it matters if it happens tomorrow, or next week.

Maybe PoJ did some things he shouldn't have, but I can understand the frustration over the matter...on both sides, and I don't think this is reason enough to lose an ally.

I am in complete agreement with Checkers. The SP's first alligience is to their own citizens and their own laws, as is ours to our citizens and laws. It is not fair for us to attempt to force an action upon them.

My issue with moving away from diplomacy with the SP is not about their mechanisms. I accept that they have laws. My initial demand contemplated that - I gave 48 hours for an appology, at which time they were to either eject CP or consider it through their laws via trial, vote, or whatever.

Even if CP is not ejected by March 2, they have, in fact, met with our demand by putting the process into place.

In effect, our demand has already been met.

My concern however is two-fold:

1. We are a small region, and only have the resources to have diplomatic ties with a few regions. We must choose our diplomatic ties carefully. As PM, I am looking to forge ties with regions that are responsive and well organized. As a small region, we do not have the luxury of being able to put up with undependable.

In this case, it's not that the response took so long that burns me, its that they had ample opportunity to respond sooner. If the SP government was on holiday for the weekend and responded as soon as they could when they returned, that's one thing. However, they just sat around, on-line, and just chose not to bother governing. PoJ knew, and did nothing. LR was online, but simply chose not to look at her telegrams when she first logged on, choosing instead to wait 12 more hours.

This is not the dependable responsive diplomatic contact I am looking for. Sorry.

2. Just as importantly is the fact that PoJ is now misrepresenting my position, and he is doing so intentionally. For him to suggest we only brought this to the SP's attention last night was a lie. I have a telegram dated yesterday morning from PoJ sitting in my inbox, which is proof that the SP, and PoJ, knew about this long before he claims.

At this point, I find the SP government to be anything but dependable and punctual, and I don't trust the person they sent here as an ambassador, as he has lied and misrepresented our position to his own people.

I'd agree with you that perhaps the first sin listed above is worthy of forgiveness. It is a sign of poor organization, and not of malice. But when your diplomat lies and misrepresents what the leader of another region has said, that is unacceptable. That is malicious and wrong on too many levels. Especially when I have evidence that the person who made teh accusation knowingly lied:


Re:Incident, Feb 29 2004, 06:35 AM

Draft Pick


Group: Visitors
Posts: 8
Joined: 3-February 04

QUOTE
A South Pacific Nation, called "chickenpants" proposed the following UN resolution, entitled "End the Canadian Problem"

Description: The Canadians have been entering the societys of all of our Nations. They have Currupted the national governments of all member Nations. The Canadians, With there leafs, must be put into seperation camps. All of our economys are suffering under these Canadians and we must end the problem. In fact this could Actually help the economys of all memeber nations by having the Canadians produce cheap product while they attend the Seperation Camps. Anyone that is at least 1/8 Canadian will be considered Canadian and will be sent to the Camps.
We Must end the Canadian problem before it gets out of hand.

I immediately wrote to LadyRebels, Delegate of the SP, stating how disappointed I was that someone in her region would write such a heinous proposal.

My gut reaction is get cabinet to discuss breaking off all ties with the SP. However, prior to doing that, I am going to await LadyRebels' response to my expression of outrage.

As our ambassadorial contact, I thought I should also directly inform you of my outrage. Please govern yourself accordingly.



On behalf of the government and region of the South Pacific you have my apologies and my promise to deal with the problem and the aforementioned nation.

I looked for a place on your forums to post my feelings on the matter and found none. My search was quick and I didn't want to start a new thread if one already existed.

If one doesn't exist, I ask your permission to start one so your region can express themselves and I will be happy to "face the music" as having a outlet is sometimes very important.

I am also taking this to my government and will let the aforementioned nation "feel your pain".

Peace




--------------------

Richard von Joshua
President; Promise of Joshua
Ambassador from the South Pacific


He's lying to his people, he is misrepresenting the situation and what I am saying. He is doing it knowlingly to cover his own butt. The date on the PM I reproduced is 6:35 a.m. yesterday. A full 14.5 hours earlier than he claims. He is knowingly lying to his people, and is misrepresenting the entire situation.

If this is to be the foundation of a relationship between the regions, I'm not interested.