I reckon they are just brilliant this season Iam loving it just watchin them its soo good. Preston and Rhys have been the best all season i reckon deserve rep honours in the near future what do u guys think?

Yeah I love the Highlanders

Yeah, I'll almost feel bad when Newcastle thrash them this Friday and end their season prematurely.

Chris

It surely will not be a thrashing chris i think you have your wires crossed.

Short of Joey going out injured, we'll win by 14+. That is, assuming the team isn't injury raped for the 17th time this season.

I pity the team that meets Newie full strength. It's yet to happen this season.

Chris

I disagree entirely and am confussed at how such a knowledgeable person such as yourself could write off the team on top of the ladder. You may call it a fluke and that they havent played any decent sides but the fact is that after 18 rounds Penrith are on top. Now that is 17 games they have played, only 4 losses. If your going to write off a team who has won 13 out of 15 games recently over a team who are only in the top eight because they didn't have to play last week then I seriously doubt anything you say. And if players are out that is no reason for complaints a great team should have back ups. If they have to rest solely on the shoulders of a few then I dred any injury then incur. The knights will probably win on the weekend but the margin should be lower than what your predicting. But don't be shocked for a surprise Penrith always perform well at Newcastle.

Yay Randell.

I wouldn't complain if it were one or even five players injured- but when you have up to 10 regular first graders out at a given time, you have a right to see things wrong.

Your ill thought out argument 'that a great team should have back-ups' is hilarious. Our back-ups are even injured, as evidenced by the absence of players such as Clint Newton, Daniel Abraham, and Matthew Jobson.

The fact that Penrith's greatest injuries this season have been to bench players such as Swain and Pritchard, or (shock horror) to an up and coming Country player- would indicate that you wouldn't know what it's like to have Origin and injury ravage side.

At no point did I say Penrith's success was 'a fluke' or write them off. I said that a full strength Newcastle side could beat them, and I stand by that. The full strength Newcastle lineup could beat any side, as evidenced by their record over the past five years.

Your idiotic statement that 'Newcastle are only in the eight because of the bye' is as insightful as if I argued 'Penrith first because they had a bye' or 'they're only first because Origin ravaged Brisbane for you'. You take the opportunities you're given. Every side gets two byes, so it's scarcely an argument to give the bye credit for Newcastle's position on the ladder.

That said, I do actually like Penrith, when you're not spouting their virtues as if they'd been world beaters for the past three seasons. You're sounding scarily like Magro. Scarily so.

Chris

Penriths Greatest injuries haven't been swain or pritchard, to be precise they havent even been injured this season they have come in for our injured players, such as Shane Rodney, Trent Waterhouse, Ben Ross, Ben Reynolds, Ryan Girlder(Who was injured for about 10 rounds of the season),we have not had the amount of serious injuries that the knights have sustained and it's true we don't have as many origin stars as the knights but what the panthers do have is depth across the field. At the moment they have the best two second rowers in the comp, they also have the leading try scorer who was also unlucky to miss out on selection for origin(everybody accepts that), We also have a halves combintion that is on fire, a hooker that is in some of te best form of his carrer, Wingers who have been tipped to be future origin stars, We have a former australian and nsw centre who has been unlucky with injury in the last few seasons, And front rowers who have been hailed by alot of the footy show as being some of the toughest in the league, And then we have our only origin rep at lock. My point is if you take out any of these players there would be no difference to the squad hell take out 5 or 6 pick the team for origin. But the good thing about Penrith is we have numerous back ups in reserve. It may not be the tellings of a great team but it is the tellings of a successful team. Clint Newton? Matthew Jobson? are a bunch of nobody's. Daniel Abraham is not a back up he is a starter.

My argument that I made about Penriths 'fluke' had nothing to do with any comments that you had made in your post. It was coming from disscussions we had, had before about how Penrith hadn't played any decent sides this year. We it is Round 18 and we have beaten all of the teams except Brisbane and Melbourne. We have even beaten a full strength bulldogs side just recently who you were handsomely beaten by WITH your origin stars.

My Idiotic stament that Newcastle are only in the eight because of the bye is (shok Horror) true if the knights were to play in round 18 then they would be without their origin players and with all their injuries/suspenions they woud have to field a side pretty much made up of reserve graders. If st george won on the weekend you would still be outside the eight. Conversly if you had played and lost and st george had, had the bye then I would then be able to say that they are only in the eight because of the bye.

I am not saying that Penrith have been world beaters for the past three seasons infact we were far from it picking up the wooden spoon two seasons ago. But was just responding to the statement jelly made about them performing brilliant this season in which you yourself have to admit they have. I as a Penrith suporter am rapped to see my side actually do well showing form just like they did in 91 which was the last time we truly tasted glory.

'Short of Joey going out injured, we'll win by 14+. That is, assuming the team isn't injury raped for the 17th time this season.'

Seventeenth time this season come on chris there is no way in this world that newcastle have been injury ravaged that many times. Maybe one or two players out but never the enormity as to which you suggest. I guess it's not Newcastles fault that they are tagged with the fact that they can't win without joey.

'I pity the team that meets Newie full strength. It's yet to happen this season.'

Penrith first played Newcastle this season and thrashed them. All be it an origin and injury ravaged side, however even the experts of the game suggested that no matter what team they would have fielded that day Penrith still would have beat them on their merits.

And to add with it my pride for Penrith is much like your pride for Newcastle... blind. This is a good thing to have a great belief in your side. Mine is a little weaker than yours however I believe that on their day any side can beat anyone. Saying I'm sounding like Magro well that is your opinion I atleast admit when my team is beaten and not showing good form, I don't look for reasons.

This may once again be an amount of idiotic statements but its truth. If you would like to go further I would go back to round two when your full strength side was beaten by the roosters. Then jump ahead a round and you'll see the roosters being beaten by the Pathers. Each team is different from week to week a team that under perfroms one week can come out and play classy perfect football the other. No one can predict an outcome, I just ask that you not write off a side that has shown so far this season that if you do write them off they will hurt you.

Well, once I finish laughing at this mish-mosh of poor argument, I'll address the entire thing. OK, I've recovered. Here goes.

Penriths Greatest injuries haven't been swain or pritchard, to be precise they havent even been injured this season they have come in for our injured players, such as Shane Rodney, Trent Waterhouse, Ben Ross, Ben Reynolds, Ryan Girlder(Who was injured for about 10 rounds of the season),
You list one quality player there. Rodney, Waterhouse, Ross, and Reynolds are just as 'nobody' as Newton and Jobson. Girdler is a good player, and he's proved that since his return.

we have not had the amount of serious injuries that the knights have sustained and it's true we don't have as many origin stars as the knights but what the panthers do have is depth across the field. At the moment they have the best two second rowers in the comp .
I'd say they're up there, but not the best. They're in form, but I'd still rate Tallis and Kennedy above them, when they're fit.

And front rowers who have been hailed by alot of the footy show as being some of the toughest in the league, And then we have our only origin rep at lock.
Tough is another word for talentless. Anyone with a sub-standard IQ and a hundred kilograms of weight can play front-row.

My point is if you take out any of these players there would be no difference to the squad hell take out 5 or 6 pick the team for origin. But the good thing about Penrith is we have numerous back ups in reserve. It may not be the tellings of a great team but it is the tellings of a successful team.
OK, let's take out Gower, Priddis, Wesser, Galavao, Puletua, and Lewis or Girdler. How good do Penrith look now? You can't argue that you'd still win games without them, because you've had most of them on-deck all season.

If we want to do a similar analysis of Newcastle's side you have.
Fullback: Picked for Origin ahead of Wesser this year.
Wingers: Current NSW/Aussie winger and one former NSW/Aussie winger
Centres: Current NSW/Aussie centre and one former NSW fullback/centre
Halfback: Joey. 'Nuff said
Props: Matt Parsons (Was form prop before injury) and Josh Perry (Current NSW)
Hooker: Current NSW/Aussie hooker. Rated as one of the best hookers in recent years.
Second Row: Two current NSW players, with Kennedy playing for Aus.

Now, consider that we've been without Robbie O for the past few weeks, Mad Dog only just got back, and the remainder have been playing Origin (Hughes' excluded), and you can see that that is a fairly gaping hole in our lineup. Brisbane and Sydney show what happens when you have so much talent out. Penrith haven't been there this year, so you can't argue that they'd perform with six out.

[i[Daniel Abraham is not a back up he is a starter.[/i]
Do your research. If Newcastle is at full-strength, Abraham is a bench player. The second row is Kennedy/Simpson, and Rudder slots into lock.


My argument that I made about Penriths 'fluke' had nothing to do with any comments that you had made in your post. It was coming from disscussions we had, had before about how Penrith hadn't played any decent sides this year. We it is Round 18 and we have beaten all of the teams except Brisbane and Melbourne. We have even beaten a full strength bulldogs side just recently who you were handsomely beaten by WITH your origin stars.
You beating the Dogs doesn't have any reflection on our side being beaten by them. That's like arguing 'Newcastle beat Souths' and then saying, 'since Souths beat Sydney, Newcastle must be the better side'. Newcastle didn't show up, and every side does it.

Seventeenth time this season come on chris there is no way in this world that newcastle have been injury ravaged that many times. Maybe one or two players out but never the enormity as to which you suggest. I guess it's not Newcastles fault that they are tagged with the fact that they can't win without joey.

a). I'm not exagerrating. Newcastle have not been at full strength all season. It happens, but if you do your research, you'll find I'm right. Hell, the side we're fielding this week is as close to full strength as we've been all year- and we're still missing BK.
B). Cheap shot on the last line. If that's the best you can manage, I guess I've wrapped this argument up nicely.

'I pity the team that meets Newie full strength. It's yet to happen this season.'

Penrith first played Newcastle this season and thrashed them. All be it an origin and injury ravaged side, however even the experts of the game suggested that no matter what team they would have fielded that day Penrith still would have beat them on their merits.
I'd love to see where you read this 'expert' statement, because I doubt it's real. Aside from the fact 'experts' such as Gould and Sterling have Newcastle tipped as the team most likely to take out this comp, I scarcely ever listen to the so-called experts.

And to add with it my pride for Penrith is much like your pride for Newcastle... blind. This is a good thing to have a great belief in your side. Mine is a little weaker than yours however I believe that on their day any side can beat anyone. Saying I'm sounding like Magro well that is your opinion I atleast admit when my team is beaten and not showing good form, I don't look for reasons.
I look for reasons because there are reasons. It's not like Newcastle are at full strength and struggling. They're injury ravaged, Origin raped, and it hurts their form. Brisbane and Sydney are in the same boat, except Brisbane have a ludicrously good junior system, and Sydney's cap is a little... iffy.

Well, I'm done.

What fun!

Chris

i didnt read all of that, too much reading for my impatient self. but i love the penny panthers and if broncos arent top of the table then i can definetly handle the panthers on top. knights will get pwned on friday. go wesser!

You laugh, well in a sese I guess that shows your ignorance to anything that I say whether it be justified or not. I guess I have recovered from your little Newcastle peropaganda piece so I'll just move on.

"I'd say they're up there, but not the best. They're in form, but I'd still rate Tallis and Kennedy above them, when they're fit."

The experts that I talk about just happen to be the footy show panel. The panel admits that they are the two best in the game at the moment because of their hot form. When I said that even with a full strength Newcastle side we would have beatan them. that is only because of what the footy show "ACTUALLY" said. So I think that they aare good enough and I am sure they exist.

"Aside from the fact 'experts' such as Gould and Sterling have Newcastle tipped as the team most likely to take out this comp, I scarcely ever listen to the so-called experts."

They might have tipped Newcastle to take the comp but my point wasn't anything to do with the outcome of the Finals, It was to do with the fact that even though you didn't field a full stength side, the men you are speaking of said that Penrith still would have won on the day no matter what the circumatnces.

"I'm not exagerrating. Newcastle have not been at full strength all season. It happens, but if you do your research, you'll find I'm right. Hell, the side we're fielding this week is as close to full strength as we've been all year- and we're still missing BK."

Newcastle may not have been at complete 100% this season however they have fielded sides with about 85% of their full strength. Probably the only time you have ben truly injury ravaged this season is beacause of players on origin duties wern't there.

"Cheap shot on the last line. If that's the best you can manage, I guess I've wrapped this argument up nicely"

This wasn't a cheap shot infact it is something that your experts always talk about. It was also a big thing last year in the finals. Newcastle finaly had a chance to prove that without Johns they could still pull it off. However they failed at that, even though performing well in the first half. If you ask anybody out their they will tell you that for Newcastle side to make it nowadays they need Andrew Johns.


"Tough is another word for talentless. Anyone with a sub-standard IQ and a hundred kilograms of weight can play front-row."

Though= Talentless hey, well get this the New Zealand forwards are called tough, The current Australian prop Shane Webcke is the toughest. Does that automaically mean that Webcke is the most talentless player in the NRL. And if so why the hell does he play for Australia. And what word does describe a good front rower, is it a fairy which means talented, If a front rower is not tough then I fear any opposition he has running at him.

Fullback: Picked for Origin ahead of Wesser this year.

Picked ahead of Wesser this year only because of his origin experience and the fact that when he does play for Queensland he is on the wing. Once again the 'Experts' have declared that wesser should have been picked.


Do your research. If Newcastle is at full-strength, Abraham is a bench player. The second row is Kennedy/Simpson, and Rudder slots into lock.

If I was to do my research, I'm sure I would find that he has started more games this year. It may be due to injuries in the squad but yiou would have to say if a player starts more times than coming off the banch he is a starter funny how you forgot to mention that Abraham was also looked at for origin selection.

"You beating the Dogs doesn't have any reflection on our side being beaten by them. That's like arguing 'Newcastle beat Souths' and then saying, 'since Souths beat Sydney, Newcastle must be the better side'. "

That wasn't my point I wasn't saying either was the better side. Its just that you'd expect a decent scoreline in that game instead of the trampling that you endured.
You had all your origin stars there and you could produce Nothing.

"Newcastle didn't show up, and every side does it."

The first time I have heard that from you. WOW. Tell me what players were out for that game. I wanna compare it to the full strength side. Just say you were missing two or three players that would make you lets say 85% full strength. Then that would mean that an 85% full strength side was beaten by the bulldogs, That other 15% would want to be the best players in the history of the game.

"still missing BK"
BK is suspended for a dangerous tackle he is not injured or playing for origin. Even though he would be if he were able to play.

I have once again placed my arguments. But I am afraid that we will never have closure on the issue. You see I am trying to prove that Penrith are a good team and that they are on top due to good form and the fact that they have been able to grit out close games this season which is something they have not been able to do in previous years. All I wanted to prove was that you should not write them off. Unlike yourself who is just trying to prove that on paper the Newcastle Knights are the 'Best' team. I agree Newcastles side is good and will be up there this year as I agree that Sydney, Brisbane, Bulldogs, Canberra, Penrith, and who knows maybe they might win the comp proving the 'experts' right. But the point still remains that on Friday night the 1st side will play the 8th side and it will be a good game No matter the result.

I'll never get tired of putting down your pointless arguments, although I would be pleased if you could alleviate some of the gross spelling errors and maybe learn the concept of paragraphs in your work.


The experts that I talk about just happen to be the footy show panel. The panel admits that they are the two best in the game at the moment because of their hot form. When I said that even with a full strength Newcastle side we would have beatan them. that is only because of what the footy show "ACTUALLY" said. So I think that they aare good enough and I am sure they exist.
You're joking, right? The 'experts' on the Footy Show? I can't believe anyone actually gives them that credit. Fatty is the most biased idiot you'll ever meet, and is close to last in everyone tipping comp he's entered. He got fired from Manly for Christ's sake. Sterlo is respectable, but the two ex Newcastle jokers are hardly experts. I thought you'd at least dredge up experts with some respectability, even Frilingos or Rabs would've been better than using Fatty to argue your case.

Newcastle may not have been at complete 100% this season however they have fielded sides with about 85% of their full strength. Probably the only time you have ben truly injury ravaged this season is beacause of players on origin duties wern't there.
What does this prove? Being 85% is still less than being 100%. Penrith haven't dipped below 85% all year, and it's not because of depth, it's because they've been lucky enough to avoid injury.

If I was to do my research, I'm sure I would find that he has started more games this year. It may be due to injuries in the squad but yiou would have to say if a player starts more times than coming off the banch he is a starter funny how you forgot to mention that Abraham was also looked at for origin selection.
No, he wasn't. Simpson and Perry were, Abraham was a rumoured emitting from Newcastle. He barely made Country.

As for your 'fact' that he's started more times than coming off the bench just proves my point. At full strength he's a bench player, so if he's playing a lot of run on games, that must say a lot about how many times we've been able to field a full strength forward pack.

You had all your origin stars there and you could produce Nothing.
How many times did Penrith produce 'nothing' last year. Your side hasn't changed a lot from last year. Taking two years to 'click' is hardly impressive.

The first time I have heard that from you. WOW. Tell me what players were out for that game. I wanna compare it to the full strength side. Just say you were missing two or three players that would make you lets say 85% full strength. Then that would mean that an 85% full strength side was beaten by the bulldogs, That other 15% would want to be the best players in the history of the game.
I'll give you some credit, and assume you just didn't get my point, and you're not a complete idiot. I said they didn't turn up. It wasn't because of injuries or Origin duties, it was lethargy at its worst. Penrith have done it this year, it's just they've been lucky enough to save it for games against sides like Souths- who can't punish them for it.

I have once again placed my arguments. But I am afraid that we will never have closure on the issue. You see I am trying to prove that Penrith are a good team and that they are on top due to good form and the fact that they have been able to grit out close games this season which is something they have not been able to do in previous years. All I wanted to prove was that you should not write them off.
You're completely lost, aren't you? I've already said Penrith are a good team, I said it in my first post. I never 'wrote them off', I simply said that Newcastle should win. At no point did I say they were a fluke, or even counter your argument to the contrary. Methinks someone's just really bored, and can't find another way to vent.

Chris

You forget that Phil Gould is also part of the footy show. He said the exact same thing as the others. And to be quite honest I would like to see your criteria as to how you can put down a man who has played for his state and his country, while also commentating on the game for years. I have been watching football since I was a little kid but I can't say that I am an expert because I have no idea what it's like to play in a preimership side, or an origin side, or for my country. Fatty has more experience in the game, he has played alongside the greats. Just looking at that you would have to give his opinions some credit. Fatty does tend to be biased but only towards about three teams Manly, Brisbane and Queensland.

What does 85% compared to 100% prove. It proves that with a decent line up on the day you still could not match it. My point was that you said with your full side you could defeat anyone on the day. With a decent 85% you should still be able to present a challenge to the opposition. Penrith have been lucky enough to escape injury but I wasn't talking about Penrith in this point.

On the footy show about 3 weeks ago the panel were talking about possible inclusions into the blues side for Origin Three. This Panel which included PHIL GOULD who is (Shock Horror) The NSW coach, Talked through a bunch of players, Phil Gould also then mentioned the name Daniel Abraham and said he was also being considered. I'm not too sure but if the actual origin coach mentioned that he was being considered for a spot, Then I think Abraham might have been.(Tell me thats a pointless argument)

"I've already said Penrith are a good team, I said it in my first post"

I just flicked through the other posts and have not seen any comment like that. You said you liked Penrith but that barely can be counted as you think they are a good side. If I was to say I like Souths, it wouldn't mean I thought the were good.

"How many times did Penrith produce 'nothing' last year. Your side hasn't changed a lot from last year. Taking two years to 'click' is hardly impressive"

Now Chris I beleive you are the one who is lost. If you go back through to my posts you will see that I have not said that Penrith were good in years before. Infact I said the opposite. The fact they produced nothing last year means nothing to this argument. The argument was solely about you giving them no chance this week against the Knights. Penrith has been going through a rebuilding process over the last few years. It just happened that in 2003 they would finally learn how to play together. this is roughly due to Preston Campbell and Jong Lang.

"I'll give you some credit, and assume you just didn't get my point, and you're not a complete idiot. I said they didn't turn up."

Thanks I know I am not a complete idiot. Now I was wondering something just say the Newcastle Team at full strength doesn't in a sense turn up to a game. Does that mean they'll lose or win because a full strength side will beat any team in the comp.

"I never 'wrote them off', I simply said that Newcastle should win. At no point did I say they were a fluke, or even counter your argument to the contrary. Methinks someone's just really bored, and can't find another way to vent."

Now Chris I just want to cear another thing with you ok. Just look at these two posts;

"Yeah, I'll almost feel bad when Newcastle thrash them this Friday and end their season prematurely."

"Short of Joey going out injured, we'll win by 14+. "

Now if this isn't writing them off then what the hell is it. 14+ is a trashing and certainly not giving Penrith credit. End their season prematurely? Well I know this is just carcasm but maybe you should have deleted that post before saying you never wrote them off.
And truth be told yes I am bored. But that has nothing to do with me posting these arguments. I am merley responding to your comments which I believe some to be false. One thing I don't get is that I already cleared up my fluke statement in a previous post. Maybe you are the bored one. Just to refresh your memory here is what I said;

"My argument that I made about Penriths 'fluke' had nothing to do with any comments that you had made in your post. It was coming from disscussions we had, had before about how Penrith hadn't played any decent sides this year. Well it is Round 18 and we have beaten all of the teams except Brisbane and Melbourne."

Lastly I am sorry about my spelling errors. I thought you would be pleased with my gramar especially seeing as I am a talentless ex front rower with a low IQ. You see when I played for my teams I was thought of as one of the toughest in the team. Funny how you blurt out statements without considering that the person your arguing with was once a Front Rower. And hey I go to University. The tone that you attack my points really shows how little you do think of me. Thanks for opening my eyes.

Glad to be of service. I sometimes deign to help the little people.

Newcastle will lose anyway. They always do when I decide to defend them. As soon as I lose faith, they hammer someone.

Chris

See, what'd I tell you.

I back them, and we lose the game.

Full credit to Penrith, they handled the pressure well and seized their opportunities- whereas Newcastle blew their two biggest ones.

I've just got to reiterate arguments made by league pundits all week. When you've got a big match like this, involving one (or more) of the sides heavily represented in Origin (Bulldogs, Sydney, Brisbane, Newcastle, or even North Queensland), you really need to schedule things better.

I'd have been happy to see this game on Sunday, where both sides could be fresh. I'm not making excuses, but you could see that a lot of Newie players (and Sattler, for what it's worth) looked tired after Wednesday's game.

And what the fuck is with Manly getting another TV game!? They're playing awfully, and Nine has ignored the bigger clash between Melbourne and Brisbane. That, coupled with North Queensland never getting any coverage (as opposed to Manly, Wests, and Souths- who get plenty despite being ineligible for the finals), shows Nine's lack of commitment to furthering the game.

Chris

GO THE DOGS!
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just to clear something up. Sattler was dropped and didn't play in origin three. I was surprised with the result and could have swore newcastle should have score in the second half by got they had enough chances, Its the best defence I have seen Penrith ever play, Take out the first thirty and it is.